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1  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: F/XT or outlaw class engine build prices? on: December 17, 2014, 10:06:54 AM
Intek is best bang for buck. It makes alot of torq with not that much money involved. I wana say 2000 to 3000. Vanguards you need to spin it to the moon to make power. Kohler is like 4000 pluse.

Not sure where any of those numbers or info came from. Any brand of engine if built correctly will make enough power to win races in the hands of a good driver. You can spend about as much as your budget will allow, and they all cost about the same to price to build. I would build a Kohler or a Vanguard. But the Inteks and Tecumsehs make great power too.  It mainly comes down to personal preference, or what engine you can get a good deal on.
2  Engine Help / Kohler Engines / Re: Turning down a 1-1/8" crankshaft question on: December 15, 2014, 07:11:34 PM
There are a few different pto lengths for the 1" cranks so there will be multiple part numbers. Get the shortest one possible to get more weight off the crankshaft. Send me a pm and i will get you the crank you need.
3  Engine Help / Kohler Engines / Re: Turning down a 1-1/8" crankshaft question on: December 15, 2014, 01:38:20 PM
The 1" cranks are easy to find for the Kohlers. As chuck said, all the Kohler command v-twin cranks are interchangeable for both horizontal and vertical engines from 18-30hp, the 30hp crank just has a slightly longer stroke. I can get brand new 1" cranks pretty cheap, they are new old stock from a distributor or pull outs from brand new engines.
4  For Sale / Want To Buy / Who Has It? / Re: 30 cube performance long rod and piston set on: December 09, 2014, 08:57:07 PM
Performance v-twins should have what you need. I also have a nice combo that works well using an ARC long rod and flat top piston.
5  General / Coffee Shop / Re: BP's on: December 07, 2014, 02:45:09 PM
The numbers in BP started falling off the minute George Herrin said he was building a Supermod and retiring from the class.
Sorry folks, but he is the pied piper, and the mice followed him to Supermod. The mice, and a few rats too... heh heh.

The supermod style class jump was caused by Ryan Kerr and his blue ford outlaw twin, when he came down to the All American back in 2008 and pretty much lapped the field in a class all his own. Just about everyone there wanted one after that. I built the first Super Mod twin the ARMA national points circuit in 2009 and ended up winning the first national points championship, and didn't have much competition wise even at the 2009 all american. It's not like that anymore. And while FXT/ Super Mods handle better, on most tracks they are far from easy to drive. Anyone who says that has probably not been in the seat of a big HP machine and made 20 to 30 laps. The low ride height in the kart seat on a rough track amplifies every little bump, leaving you feeling like you've been repeatedly kicked in the back after the race.  But even after driving the supermods, I still love the BP class and how the machines look. Plus, the audience loves a crash! The BP drivers just need to learn to tuck and roll like George, or fly like Rooster!  lol
6  General / Coffee Shop / Re: BP's on: December 06, 2014, 11:20:36 AM
The issues with the BP class and crashes have nothing to do with the mower.

It is the drivers. 

Exactly... I drove in BP for a few years with great success, and most issues were normally the result of inexperienced drivers. I've had entire races wheel to wheel with people who know their machine and how to handle it, and never had an accident. I've seen governed classes have more wrecks and injuries than the prepared classes before..
7  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: 30 cube vanny 2 barrel elbow question on: December 06, 2014, 11:11:41 AM
Just simply turn the elbow around the other direction and make the carb point out the flywheel side. You will have to drill and tap a hole in the intake manifold face for the middle bolt. You will see its drill and tapped in the center on one side, but not the other. I believe its an M6-1.0 thread.
8  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: 38 vanny head gasket on: December 03, 2014, 08:53:54 AM
If it was a grass cutter you could just knock it back in and use a punch in a few places and it would probably last the life of the engine. But in a performance or racing motor, i wouldn't even try it. Get a new oversized seat put in, blend it back into the port and do a nice valve job. It can be done for less than $100.
9  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: intek on: November 26, 2014, 01:06:42 PM
Where are you guys getting the idea of a 60+ cube kohler? No one that I know in mower racing has one of those. I know most of the people who run a Kohler, and did work on probably half of them. I discuss alot with Julian at MWSC and they sell maybe two engines a year that are that extreme, and they aren't to mower racers. The Kohlers don't get the big CI from boring, the material isn't there either. The biggest bore you can put in a Kohler takes a lot of work by boring the sleeves out and running a Nikasil coating directly on the aluminum. Even still they only end up around .100" bigger bore than stock. But that engine combo will run hot and isn't meant to be ran long. It's common in the pulling world but not mower racing. That still doesn't make the engine anywhere close to 60ci, actually not even 50ci.  The big CI gain is done by using a longer stroke billet crank, which can be made for any brand of engine out there. People would be surprised to see that most of the best running Kohlers in lawnmower racing are well under 50ci and have a stock bore, or close to it. Most of Ryker's fastest engines were only 45ci or less.

I don't see an issue with guys running a 49ci Intek block, and neither would most other racers. Even though its starting with a bigger CI, it's still a "small block" engine and ends up with the same result as boring/sleeving while reducing costs for racers. Some people just like to complain. And it's legal in ARMA to run the 49ci block since their rule is 49ci and under factory rated starting point.
10  Engine Help / Kohler Engines / Re: 18hp CH 2 barrel on: November 26, 2014, 08:29:08 AM
The 2 Barrels were only on the 30 hp motor both vertical and horizontal.  That intake and carb will bolt up on 18 - 27 hp commands.

That's not true, they actually have two barrel intakes on several of the new 2014/2015 model engines including a 22hp CV682 or CH682, and many other models from 22-27hp as well as the 30hp. But you are correct in that the two barrel intakes will bolt up to any of the 18-30hp engines.
11  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: intek on: November 24, 2014, 07:59:32 AM
Hey, Rene Don't cheet just take the 44" block stroke crank from 2.890 to 3.000 and bore & sleeve from 3.120 to 3.300! Put's you at 52 ci. I learned that from Kolher guy's There's all kinds of ways to beat tech.   LoL!    Ron

So, Zack.  What do you guy's do about these 58-60 CI. Kolhers  Us Briggs guy's should by 54-61 CI. vanny's ?  Ron.

Ron, maybe your memory is short, but should i remind that you started the Kohler talk in this section and took the thread on dirt road.. I am simply clarifying false information about Kohler engines in a thread taken on that topic. But go ahead and build whatever size engine you want, you won't see the Kohler guys complaining. And good luck building anything better than Zach Kerber or MWSC has already built. A motor like Paul's little 44ci makes more power than a machine and track can handle. That being said, bench racing is one of best parts of this sport  lol
12  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: intek on: November 24, 2014, 04:15:20 AM
The biggest engine Kohler makes (in the standard small block series) is a 30hp CH/CV750 engine and it is 45.6 CI. A 25hp engine is 44 CI. The 25hp and the 30hp have the exact same block with a 3.27 (83mm) bore size, the only internal difference is the 25hp has a 67mm stroke crank and the 30hp has a 69mm stroke crank. The 25hp and 30hp block can have the same part number.  Buy a 30hp crank for your 25hp engine and you end up with the same result. And as Paul said, to make a 20hp Kohler into a 25hp all it takes is a simple bore job.  So the thought about all the "illegal" kohlers doesn't even make sense.

If you guys look closely at the rules in FXT/Super Mod Twin for example, it says you must START with a certain factory rated HP or CI block, and from there in the US rules it clearly states " Modification to block and heads are open" and in ARMA "Modifications to the block and heads are unlimited." What CI you achieve using your Factory block is only limited by your imagination (or wallet), but go too big and you will have a bucket full of parts after a few races if that.  Most of the Kohlers that are the front runners are actually well under 50ci. The big radical engines run hot and are more prone to failure due to the thin cylinder walls and high compression. An extreme motor is very hard on parts. That's why you see the Nascar and NHRA guys rebuilding their motors after every race, and even then they still have failures. Ryan Kerr's wicked Kohlers won a lot of races at only 45CI. All the top guys in the V-twin classes are making great HP, now it comes down to who has the best handling chassis and can drive it consistent every lap.
13  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: intek on: November 23, 2014, 04:30:48 PM
The rules say you must start with a certain HP engine block, the rest of the internal mods and ending CI are unlimited. Start with a legal block, bore it, stroke it, or do whatever you want inside, it's legal. There are Intek twins and Tecumseh twins well over 50ci as well as the Kohlers, and all are 100% legal. They all make big power. It comes down to who has spent the most time getting that power to hook up, and the chassis to handle it entering and exiting the corners.  Mike Collins does this very well, and he would be fast with whatever brand of engine he had.

thank you,we gonna nail a cheater next season,but waitn on him to spend big bucks on his motor before we tell him there is a difference in blocks,lol

Why do that? You could potentially lose a racer over a possible misunderstanding.  Just inform him you must start with a 44ci block (or whatever is legal in your club), and then bore/sleeve it to the 49ci or whatever bore, keeping him within the rules.
14  Engine Help / Briggs OHV & Vanguard / Re: Intake Manifold Modification Thoughts on: November 21, 2014, 03:59:59 PM
I've done this on several v-twin racing engines with great success. It just takes some patience to get the jetting correct. And I have a new style two barrel carb that actually has a built in accelerator pump  Cool
15  Engine Help / Honda and Clone Engines / Re: 420 vertical on: November 14, 2014, 09:51:30 AM
No need for converting, they have been making a 420cc vertical shaft clone engine for a while now. It is a mower engine, so it will be legal about anywhere. Check out the link below

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