Author Topic: Supercharging  (Read 5805 times)

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Offline Gearstix

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Supercharging
« on: October 02, 2006, 04:30:41 AM »
I'd be interested in supercharging my stock 5hp if there is any gain.
I would like to do it with a smog pump. I can probably find one easily.
I dont know what they look like however.
And, I dont know how to hook it up, or what size to get.
I know of a few wrecking yards that I could get one from.
Anyone try this, or any suggestions?
Would i have to do other mods to my motor?



Offline bdmillin

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« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2006, 06:57:51 PM »
I'm going to be tring that over the next month or two. I can let ya know how it goes. I'll be using one off a early 90's small block chevy.

Offline Gearstix

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« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2006, 07:01:27 PM »
I was thinking a 2.0L Volkswagen one would work:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/95-VOLKSWAGEN-JETTA-GOLF-SMOG-PUMP-SMOG-SYSTEM-PULLY_W0QQitemZ180035053613QQihZ008QQcategoryZ33610QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting
I could also get one off a 350... I dont wan't anything too big
Still gotta figure out how to run the thing.
I would have to make a custom bracket to mount mine, since i dont have anything around the engine to mount it on.
How does it connect to the carb?
Air filtration? I think some pumps you can hook up/have a air filter on them


Offline bdmillin

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Supercharging
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2006, 06:43:38 AM »
The size of the pump will mainly just determine the size of your pulleys. Which one thing to look at when picking out you pump is will you be able to put on a smaller pulley if needed. You might be able to just use a bigger pulley on the engine side, (I'm going to use a pulley bolted to the flywheel).

You'll deffently want some kind of filtration. If you can't put some kind of air filter on the intake of the pump, you'll have to make a air box that is air tight with the filter inside and place it somewhere between the pump and the carb, (you might be able to make the old air filter box air tight and seal it to the carb). It would be better if the pump had an intake port that a filter could be connected to before the air is pressurized.

For connecting to the carb, the first thing that comes to mind is to use a radiator hose that is reduced down to the size of the output of the pump. Radiator hoses have nice bends and will help isolate the air from the engine heat. It might help to keep the hose the same size of the carb all the way up to the pump to keep air velocity down.

Offline Gearstix

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« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2006, 05:56:04 PM »
I dont know how id start mine because Id have to remove the blower housing or modify it and the pullet would be in the way of the starter cup. Is there any way to control how much boost it puts out, so i dont blow the cylinder off the block? What size engine are you gonna try it on?

Offline bdmillin

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« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2006, 08:37:42 PM »
The size of the pulleys will determin the amount of boost. The trick is to find out what the displacment of the smog pump is in order to calculate how rpms it needs to turn for every revolution the engine turns. I'll be putting it on a 11hp

Offline Gearstix

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« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2006, 08:42:31 PM »
I would try it but I dont want to ruin my motor, and I don't have enough cash to replace it.
If I just bought a smog pump (VW Jetta, 350 Chevy or something that has a filter) and rigged it up and fired it, could it blow it apart? Remeber I am only using a 5HP.
Another problem is the pull start
If I could rig it up to electric start for cheap.... i think it would work. and also i could run gauges etc


Offline bdmillin

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« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2006, 07:01:31 PM »
You could just hook it up if you added some kind of valve/vent between the pump and the carb. That way if you open the vent some of the air blows out lowering the amount of boost. Then you can shut the vent slowly until you get to the amount of boost you want. You'll also need a boost gauge to see how much boost your making. If you dont want to buy a gauge you could rig up a manometer with some plastic tubbing to meassure the boost. This is all asuming that the pump is going fast enough to pump out  more air than the engine sucks in normaly. If not the engine would be sucking air in through the vent. This way is a safe start, but if you blowing air out the vent you're wasting power turning the pump faster than it needs to go.

Offline matt25001149

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« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2006, 07:54:10 PM »
this vent u speak of is it noit considered a blowoff valve???
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Offline Gearstix

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« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2006, 09:29:13 PM »
if it could constantly get 5 psi i'd be happy.
I dont know if I would be able to do this, main issue is starting the darn thing.
Would a car turbo blowoff work? I don't know, never seen one.
Also, I waited 4 weeks for some linkages to come in and i ordered the wrong throttle linkage it seems, and I guess thats what happens when the engine shop won't/can't help ya and you don't have a clue what you need.

Offline bdmillin

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« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2006, 03:35:01 PM »
It would be a cheaper version of a blowoff valve. I was just thinking of a any kind of ball valve or something that might be laying around the garage, or something cheap at the hardware store. I wouldn't suggest this for a permanent solution, just something to test it, and see how it performs.

Offline Gearstix

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« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2006, 06:47:48 PM »
Would I have to advance the timing too?
I would need a list of stuff to do, because I'd probably forget :(

Tom the Canuck

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Supercharging
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2006, 08:04:45 PM »
Ok, couple of problems with this post,but i can live with it. First off im pretty sure what you guys are talking about is a blower,not a super charger. A super charger forces more fuel into the engine. A turbo charger forces more air into the engine by forcing the exhaust to spin the pump. A blower is run off of the crankshaft. All that aside this sounds like a cool idea although other things more than likely should be done first. One thing your going to need to do,if you plan on running any considerable amount of boost is lower the compression. if you do not i almost gaurantee it will detonate. Another consideration might be too balance the engine as well. This way you can rev the engine out more without running the risk of things flying apart. If you do plan on reving it out make sure you remove the governor assembly(if it is internal) at highspeeds these things fly apart and wreck things,expensive things. Now considering youve done all this why not run about 16 lbs boost, 16 lbs boost doubles your horsepower. And while your at it get some NOS thats always fun. NOS can add 100 to 300 percent of your horse power. Which means if you really wanted to we could probly push about 40 horse with the right cam out of that little 5 horse! Mind you it might cost you a small fortune. Personally id start with something a little bigger than a five horse. Oh well call me old fashioned but biggers always better. Anyway ill save everyone the trouble,i know maybe this is litlle over the top,so dont bother telling me,just keep these things in mind.

Offline bdmillin

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Supercharging
« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2006, 09:07:44 PM »
You are right except for for the first part. A super charger is the same as a turbo except it runs off a belt insted of exh pressure. The fuel has to be added by the carb to keep up. N2O is the only thing that adds fuel. Which is is great because it adds Oxyegen at the same  time, win win.  But you have to refill N2O tank. You dont have to ever refill  smog pump. A blower on a 5hp is "kind of" waste except, you have to start some where. I would much rather blow up a 502 chevy than a 5hp B&s
.

But I think all of yall rock for working on such a well engineered engine. hat goes for most B&S. But not all.

Tom the Canuck

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Supercharging
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2006, 09:50:07 PM »
Right you are bdmillan, straight from wikipedia

A supercharger (also known as a blower) is an air compressor used to force more air (and hence more oxygen) into the combustion chamber(s) of an internal combustion engine than can be achieved with ambient conditions atmospheric pressure.

The additional mass of oxygen-containing air that is forced into the engine improves on its volumetric efficiency which allows it to burn more fuel in a given cycle - which in turn makes it produce more power. A supercharger can be powered mechanically by belt, gear, or chain-drive from the engine's crankshaft. It can also be driven by a gas turbine powered by the exhaust gases from the engine. Turbine-driven superchargers are correctly referred to as turbo-superchargers - or more commonly as turbochargers.